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This is Sprouts, the G&G discussion forum. Read the comments below on The Matrix and then weigh in with your own comments. Or select another issue...
ISSUE 8: THE MATRIX
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Brian O'Brien writes:
In response to 'Examining the London Bombings'
by Tony Brasunas:
There's nothing new in any of this stuff. The British government engaged in terrorist activities for over 30 years in respect of its illegal and unwanted occupation of Northern Ireland. They carried out many of the atrocities that were subsequently blamed on the IRA including the maiming and killing of many British citizens. This is still going on today. Why was Tony Blair not indicted for war crimes for the role he and his British cabinet colleagues played in the phony war of terror against Iraq?
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Larry Hannigan of Brisbane, Australia writes:
In response to 'I Want the Earth, Plus 5%'
by Larry Hannigan:
This has now been faithfully reproduced in 9 languages. Thank you. Visit www.wheylite.com.au, and link to the Voice of the Flag.
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Jim Beeker of Milwaukee, WI writes:
There is a literal mountain of evidence that casts grave doubts on the truthfulness of the 'official explanation' for 9/11. Why are we not seeing more of this evidence in the media? Some of the things I've seen would clearly warrant the front page of every major newspaper in this country, but they are all strangly quiet.
The thing that frustrates me is that when I even try to talk on this subject with my friends I'm dismissed immediately as a crack-pot conspiracy theorist - which I am not. Many people dismiss the theory of government complicity before they even hear the evidence to support it, simply because it is... Continued
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Barbara Aquino of Los Angeles, CA writes:
In response to 'Is Al Qaeda Just a Bush Boogeyman?', by Robert Scheer:
I only found this page in trying to see how I could contact Robert Scheer and lend support since I have just heard that the L.A. Times may be letting him go Jan 1, 2006. Please do what you can to keep his voice alive in one of the largest markets in the country!
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Barrie Zwicker of Toronto, Canada writes:
I was immensely favourably impressed with your analysis -- and so hot on the heels of the events -- of 7/7.
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Brian Emerick of Ocala, FL writes:
What a really great site. Thanks for your efforts.
Until we deal with the core of our problems they will never be fixed. Those problems are our representatives and how they are elected. We have to get the big corporations and big money out of the political system. I hate to sound like Ross Perot, but maybe the septic needs more than just a pumping. Maybe it's time for a new one.
The Declaration of Independence gives us the right to change our government; in fact it almost directs us to do so.
...Whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government...
Well folks, I think that time is here. Let us draw up the indictments, and get on with forming a new government.
PS: Read the first part of the DOI each week, it so inspires.
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Lance Klumpe of new south wales, australia writes:
i want to see how deep the rabbit hole goes. i know neo.
robert stinson of sydney, australia responds:
gday lance its audi rob the rabit hole is deep but good green and a volvo help
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Christopher A. Brown of Santa Barbara , CA writes:
In response to '9-11 Truth: A Story On the Verge of Breaking Through', by Tony Brasunas:
Good presentation of generally available information surrounding neglect or complicity of high government position.
I have a web page about the tower demolition based on my viewing of a 1990 PBS documentary about the construction of WTC 1. I have experience with structural steel, steel reinforced concrete and above ground blasting. This experience... Continued
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MeCoop2 writes:
Brilliant! If only people could think.
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Tom Dworkin of San Francisco, CA writes:
Here's a page with excellent links to some of the most damning articles regarding 7-7-7... www.rense.com/Datapages/londonbmb.htm
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Edward Teague of Rochdale, UK writes:
In response to 'Examining the London Bombings':
See www.postmanpatel.blogspot.com and start with a posting on June 11th and then jump to July 7th.
The 'bombers' were duped drug mules. Who organised them? Well take your pick. Read and form your own judgement.
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Kevin Christaldi of Portland, OR writes:
Good issue and excellent London supplement.
We had maybe two hundred people (over the course of a three-hour presentation) check out videos and short talks about 9/11 at the downtown library last Sunday.
Keep up the good work.
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Don Paul of San Francisco, CA writes:
Thanks for the good work here and for pressing on altogether. One of the best gatherings of information and analyses on 7/7 was done recently by Webster G. Tarpley. Webster knows false-flag operations about as well as anyone now writing.
Just in case you haven't seen
it: www.serendipity.li/london/tarpley1.htm
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Mark Leinauer, Attorney of St Louis, MO writes:
Please, lets leave the irresponsible conspiracy theories to the right wing cooks. The mere fact that one can deduce a motive for a person or a group does not mean that they perpetrated the act...and it hardly suffices as proof of anything. These are the sorts of arguments put forth by the ant-UN crowd and those that obsess over the 'Zionist conspiracy.' Hell, these arguments go back to the dawn of time. The logic is no different than that used to establish the old Knight's Templars/Stone Masons conspiracy theories.
The problem with all these theories is that they're unrealistic and completely ignore human nature. They assume a near perfect operation. Complete secrecy. Complete loyalty. And amongst an incredibly huge 'matrix' of people. What makes you think that the U.S. government (or any government for that matter) could pull this off? Have you ever worked for the government? They're just as incompetent... Continued
Tony Brasunas responds:
Thanks very much for reading, and, more, for writing. Many people I speak with share your view of terrorism, and, indeed, I shared your view until recently. By writing to me, I believe you've indicated you have the time and inkling to learn a little more about this. I hope you'll bear with me for a few more minutes to hear my two cents.
First, you may be right. The official conspiracy theory about the bombings in London... Continued
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Daniel O'Neill of San Francisco, CA writes:
I always feel heartened when I receive G&G's e-mails.
Things are so crazy right now. I live in the Bay Area and it is almost like you can see the flames everywhere around you of society burning. What terrible times we are living in! I feel attacked on so many fronts that it is overwhelming. Corporations and the government are literally getting away with murder and theft on vast scales. Corporations are the government are engaging in such egregious thievery
and deception it is hard to believe!
I just spent a year living in Germany and was an active member of the local Greenpeace group in Freiburg. In Germany there are thousands of
local Greenpeace groups that meet on a regular basis in thousands of cities across the country. It is like an accepted part of life there. I was shocked when returning here to see that there is nothing like
this here, despite the bleeding need for it. I have been trying to contact the Greenpeace office in Washington and have been getting either ignored or complete bullshit responses from them everytime I tell them that I am interested in just trying to form a group with like-minded people who can meet... Continued
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Anonymous of Santa Rosa, CA writes:
In response to 'Examining the London Bombings'
by Tony Brasunas:
Definitely food for thought. Too bad the popular media is ignoring this story. But that is no surprise given their refusal to dig into the 9-11 event.
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Jeff Strahl of Berkeley, CA writes:
The media obediently follow the cues provided by the US and British governments. They read the handed-down script regarding the London bombings, even as crucial details are being changed daily, not even pausing in the face of mounting inconsistencies. And this includes the 'progressive' media, be it the Nation or Pacifica, eager to prove they are of course not supportive of 'terrorists.' Read or listen all you want, you will find virtually no reference to the many questions being raised about the official accounts. This is quite similar to how the 9/11 events have been treated.
Among these questions are: Why and how did former Israeli prime minister get a warning to stay away from a place where he was to speak, located above one of the blast sites? How does 'suicide bombers' square with earlier police claims of timing devices? Why did the 'suspects' leave a car full of explosives in a parking... Continued
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Elias Davidsson of Reykjavik, Iceland writes:
I found
'Examining the London Bombings: An Inquiry Into Motive, Opportunity and Evidence,' by Tony Brasunas, enlightening and well articulated.
The suspicion of an 'inside job' must remain present in order to remain alert to all evidence.
I wish to add that unless we have solved the crime of 9/11, we will not solve London 7/7. And as it has become apparent that 9/11 was definitely not committed by Muslim/Al-Qaeda, the probability is that neither Madrid nor London were committed by these 'Islamic fanatics' either.
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Bob Brown writes:
This ['Examining the London Bombings'] is a great article. I was almost ready to accept the official story myself, but was wondering about other possibilities, in the light of 9-11. Hopefully, things will become clearer as time goes on. I will forward the article to my e-mail list.
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Kit Watkins of Cary, NC writes:
Amazing article on 9/11 Truth. I'll soon be exploring the rest of your site. The writing is excellent and the topics fit my outlook completely, and there's lots to learn here. Keep up the fine work!
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Anne Ford of Washington, DC writes:
Impressive website! I look forward to reading more of it. Keep up the good work.
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Blimp Pilot writes:
Nice! Lots to read.
To our own collection of zesty Red Pills, we have recently added a light discussion of simple physics related to the supposed 'gravitational' collapses of the WTC towers, and what it tells us about the 'pancake collapse' theory.
You can find it at
911blimp.net/prf_FreeFallPhysics.shtml
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Max Bushnell of Haddonfield, NJ writes:
In response to 'The Media Matrix Hides a Party', by Sam Smith:
Garlic & Grass is a moderate-green party forum that has just enough educational information to eek into the realm of pseudo-quazi-objective. That being said, 'The Media Matrix' opened the kimono a little too far.
Poll-based numbers, calculations, statistics, percentages, and color coded maps may appear quite convincing upon initial review. However, as a student of statistics and persuasion I must inquire; where is the empirical data regarding the questions, sample size, demographic, survey conductor... Continued
Anonymous responds:
Would this be William Maxwell Bushnell?
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Jorma Anttila of Helsinki, Finland writes:
In response to '9-11 Truth: A Story On the Verge of Breaking Through', by Tony Brasunas:
Very good. In Finland we have a site, www.11syyskuu.org, which provides information about the 9-11 scam. Your article was mentioned there.
There is an excellent article by Sami Yli-Karjanmaa, a member of our group, that looks at The Pentagon Building Performance Report (January 2003) by the American Society of Civil Engineers:
The ASCE's Pentagon Building Performance Report: Arrogant Deception
- Or an Attempt to Expose a Cover-up?
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Starchild of San Francisco, CA writes:
In response to 'The Matrix Hides Electoral Fraud', by Diane Perlman:
While I will not take issue with her claims that Bush won the 2004 election through vote fraud, Diane's theory that 'white, US born males are more emphatic about accepting the outcome and the futility of challenging it, while others are more willing to recognize being dominated and are open to questioning what happened' is poorly supported by the evidence.
The two presidential candidates responsible for the Ohio vote challenge, Michael Badnarik of the Libertarian Party and David Cobb of the Green Party, are both 'white' (the popular catch-all term used to lump together people of extremely diverse backgrounds and cultures from Siberia to the Azores... Continued
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Howard Switzer of Linden, TN writes:
In response to 'Behind the Veil of The Bush & Clinton Years', by Tony Brasunas:
Great job. The great success of this 'matrix' you describe, historically, is due largely to the mandatory schooling system, the implementation of which began around 1915, that inculcates society's children with the cultural lies that the matrix managers rely upon. This is described in detail in John Taylor Gatto's book, The Underground History of American Education, 2004. It has been called the 'open conspiracy' because, while the evidence was always available, it resembled more a scientifically justified engineering project and thus was not to be disputed in respectable circles. After all they had a newtopian vision they were implementing which took about 75 years to do. Without it, America would be very different and probably more democratic today. But then, who really knows?
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Cheryl D. Simmons of Danville, IL writes:
Glad I discovered your site! I will now be better informed to say the least!
Lights Lightoller of PA responds:
Excellent comment! Anyone who thinks that Bush is trying to make America safe had better THINK AGAIN! He wants America safe, all right--safe for him and his buds to pillage, and safe for them to run their oppression on everyone else...or eliminate them if they become troublesome.
I have watched the past four years since 9/11 ( or as I call it 'Bush/11')with mounting alarm. These bastards are taking over and no one does one damned thing to try to stop them. Sadly I think the only REAL patriot is one who tries to alert his fellow citizens to what is going on. This is no longer America, but Amerikka!
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Jeff Ray of San Francisco, CA writes:
Fantastic stuff! Just recently introduced to your journal by a friend.
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Byron Belitsos of Marin County, CA writes:
Awesome--a brilliant issue! I will be forwarding your link all over the place.
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Bruce Patullo of Philadelphia, PA writes:
In 'Behind the Veil of The Bush & Clinton Years', Tony Brasunas says, 'Awakening is an essential aspect of being alive. We have a deeper truth, a more universal perspective, and a freer mind to gain. We have only our delusions to lose.'
Years ago I stopped watching 60 Minutes, and the rest of it, and stopped reading several newspapers each day. Why? I got sick and tired of being pissed off about things I couldn't do anything about.
Nixon taught me: I can't do anything, because people will just stare at me like I have three heads when I try to tell them the real story. The media and only the media has the power to herd the sheep into an effective flock.
I'm mad as hell but just can't take it any more. I mean being a social pariah for knowing some of the truth.
Yeah, they've won. I gave it my best shot....but they've won.
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ISSUE 7: A TIME TO VOTE
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Katie of University Park, PA writes:
I am a student at Penn State University, and I have been greatly interested and passionate about politics for years. I just wanted to say that I am so happy to have stumbled across your publication, along with other independent news websites. It is a breath of fresh air to know that other people care about the truth, and want to get it out there. It's too bad so many people believe the lies. So, thank you.
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MaryBeth Ingberg of Chicago, IL writes:
After the election, on Nov. 3, I wrote to Kerry and to the DNC and suggested that Kerry's quick concession and refusal to follow through on his promise to 'count every vote' was a clear indication that both the DNC and Kerry had something to lose in a full-blown investigation of election fraud.
Clearly they don't want BlackBoxVoting.Org or any other source to discover election fraud, vote tampering, or any other miscellaneous criminal activities by the Kerry Campaign or the DNC while trying to uncover Bush/GOP fraud. It is not so hard to put 2+2 together, but most folks just want to believe in fairness, freedom and transparency. I wonder if the Kerry Campaign was hoping to 'out-cheat' the Bush campaign and the Bush/Rove/GOP/H.Ahmanson,Jr. regime.
Don't get me wrong: I volunteered, raised funds, traveled to another state, canvassed, phone-banked, etc. for the Kerry Campaign. But the day he conceeded and told his constituency to sit down and shut up (with grace and class, of course), and when Bill Clinton told us to stop whining -- I knew the fix was in! It's time for 'the people' to find their own voice and speak up - with or without the DNC.
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Rob Arnow of San Francisco, CA writes:
Yes, the evidence of fraud in Florida, Ohio, and many other states is growing by the minute. Even the founder and head of the polling firm Zogby International has said that something is terribly wrong. Several studies have shown that the discrepancies between exit polls and actual votes are, according to the most shocking figure, so unlikely as to have had a 1 in 250 million chance of occuring without some kind of fraud!
Counties are keeping reporters from observing vote counting, electronic machines are showing strong irregularities favoring Bush, and African-American precincts are reporting receiving so few voting machines that people had to wait in line for hours to vote.
This is a serious time in our nation's history. Voting is the right that defends all other rights. If we lose this right, we will start to see a government even less responsive to us -- one that shows the same callous disregard for our life and liberty that dictatorships do. It's time to take action. The corporate media would prefer that you accept the myth that the Democrats just weren't far enough to the right to win. Don't believe it.
The best, most comprehensive single article on the topic I've found is at verifiedvoting.org/article.php?id=5304. Two other good ones: on Ohio, and on Florida.
Call your congresspeople, senators, and local officials and demand an investigation. Or call your local newspapers and television stations and demand coverage. Easy google searches will uncover all the contact info you'll need. Now is the time.
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Trey Luerssen of Fox Sports writes:
You people are idiots.
Dave Heller of Berkeley, CA responds:
Fox Sports? Hmmm? Well, maybe you can be a little more illuminative with your comment. Try addressing our information and arguments then just attacking us. Why are we idiots?
Those tactics might work on Fox but not the more cerebral people who read Garlic & Grass.
jim olear of Newport, TN responds:
Imagine, someone from the FOX networks putting down someone else. This network that promotes bill o'reilly. As a christian i despise the idea of superiority that some christians claim to have over others. in this country, people have the right, not privelege, to have and share their opinions and beliefs with others. if i remember my history correctly, that's why people came here in the first place...maybe mr fox sports news person should look in the mirror to find a narrow minded, blinders-on, believer of what the media tells us.
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Dave Heller of Berkeley, CA writes:
To those who insisted that voters who liked Ralph Nader (I) and David Cobb (G) should hold their noses and vote for John Kerry (D), the aftermath of the election ought to show them how wrong they were.
John Kerry tucked his tail and fled after the election, leaving it to the third party candidates, with their limited resources, to save any vestige of legitimacy in the election. While Kerry has reportedly $51 million left in the bank, Cobb, Nader, and Michael Badnarik (L), with their tiny budgets, are the only ones scrambling to pull together a recount effort.
It seems clear that no matter what the true outcome of this last election, the country needs paper trails for all voting machines, as well as Instant Runoff Voting (IRV). And given San Francisco's recent election history, the fact that they managed not only to pull off their cleanest election in memory, but also to implement IRV at the same time should show that doing IRV is not a Herculean task. We just need the will to make it happen.
I call on all those who insisted we vote for the 'lesser of two evils' (LOTE) to now stand up and make a difference -- by supporting the people and joining one of the parties that are now making sure all votes are being counted. And in the future, don't LOTE the VOTE!
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Amy Wilson of HAYYHAYY@aol.com writes:
I agree with your assessment of Democrats (in Kerry Lost: Voters Chose Character and Conviction). There was an interesting editorial in Newsweek that stated that, actually, if Howard Dean had made it through the distortions and attacks made on him (like 'the scream' lie), and if Democrats had not refused to give him their primary votes because he was 'unelectable' (i.e. that he took a stance -- as your article suggests, even an unpopular one), that he really would have been in better shape in the national election than Kerry because of his clarity and strength. Kerry lacked clarity and strength.
In other words, we all gotta take a risk and also stand on principle!
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Mike Cohen of Friday Harbor, WA writes:
David Cobb has noted that the progressive's great challenge is to deal with our society's addiction to money, power, and technologies that harm people and places. However, the Greens neither use nor offer a psychology that deals with these destructive addictions. The means to reduce them is readily available and anybody can use them. See www.ecopsych.com/ninelegdenial.html for more on this.
Howard Switzer of Linden, TN responds:
I'm not sure what you mean by 'the Greens neither use nor offer a psychology that deals with these destructive addictions,' but I think you are wrong. Greens are self-reliant and have long recognized and dealt with those addictions -- the party would not exist if it hadn't -- and the GP platform seeks to deal with them on a much larger scale. Or they could just send folks to you, I suppose.
michael cohen of Friday Harbor, WA responds:
My question to David Cobb was if the psychology existed, what was it, and how was it available to others. I asked because most psychologies are not organic; the rewards for good citizenship that they offer are often environmentally destructive since our culture exploits natural systems in people and places.
Yes, they could send send folks to us or incorporate/offer our program as part of the Green platform, but he and others have shown no interest in that.
See this page for details.
Howard M. Switzer of Linden, TN responds:
I had to laugh at the image of David Cobb, whom I know and love, being asked 'What's your psychology and how do you make it available to others?' Most of us don't think in those terms, Michael. That seems to be more your area of expertise. We need more greens like you to get involved in the party, I think. Well, I say that but what you are doing is certainly very important.
I spent a lot of time on your website exploring your message, and it is the message we try to pass along in our immersion courses in permaculture and natural building at the Ecovillage Training Center on The Farm in Summertown, TN. People are always suprised that they got more than they bargained for. Of course we haven't yet got our course process down the way you apparently do to reconnect people to nature. We are flying by the seat of our pants out here exploring the great mystery... Continued
Michael Cohen of Friday Harbor, WA responds:
Thanks for your response, I wish the local Greens were as positive.
Yes, heirarchy is part of our story world that we structure, addict to, and implement, and although it is found in some social animals, it is not an exclusive story there; rather it's a means to produce optimum survival without pollution in the herd or flock as well as the environment.
By the way, you and anybody else here are welcome to do parts or all of our program starting with our Orientation Course: Psychological Elements of Global Citizenship. We have no pre-existing requirements for entry into the program. See www.ecopsych.com and let us know your areas of interest.
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Andrew Tertes of Oakland, CA writes:
What a fresh and inspiring voice! I appreciate the depth with which Ahri Golden [Voting, Not Voting, and What Really Matters] addressed fear, darkness, and the tendency toward paralyzation. In doing so, when she writes about seeing ourselves as grass in a field, together, able to collaborate, she hits the mark of empowerment.
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Mike Forbes of La Jolla, CA writes:
Hi Garlic & Grass,
I was intrigued to see the David Cobb interview [A Persuasive Progressive], and I was wondering if I could excerpt parts of it for use on Battle Cry (BattleCry-CA.com). I'd like to juxtapose with some remarks from Badnarik.
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Plant Your Own Sprout
Give in to the temptation and let fly:
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03.13 - I have very extensively researched the Twin Tower Collapses
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